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		<title>Ray Boltz new single:  Don&#8217;t Tell Me Who To Love</title>
		<link>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/</link>
		<comments>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Feb 2009 01:35:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>art rogers</dc:creator>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/?p=1463</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[<p>You may recall that Ray Boltz &#8220;came out of the closet&#8221; last year and openly confessed that he is living a homosexual lifestyle in Florida now.  You can read my article and the link to the Washington Blade magazine that carried the news in an interview with the singer:  <a title="12 Witnesses|Ray Boltz Confesses He Is Gay" href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/" target="_blank">Ray Boltz Confesses He Is Gay</a>.</p>
<p>He&#8217;s just released a new single paralleling the desire of homosexuals&#8217; to marry and the struggle to do so in America with the 1960&#8242;s era struggle of a white man&#8217;s struggle to marry a black woman detailed in the 1967 Supreme Court decision from the suit &#8220;Loving v. Virginia,&#8221; in which Chief Justice Warren wrote, &#8220;<span style="font-family: Arial;"><span style="font-size: small;">Marriage is one of the basic civil rights of man, fundamental to our very existence and survival.&#8221;</span></span></p>
<p>You can read the lyrics, hear the song and read what Boltz has to say about it on his blog:  <a title="Ray Boltz Blog|Don't Tell Me Who To Love" href="http://rayboltzblog.wordpress.com/2008/11/18/dont-tell-me-who-to-love-the-new-single/" target="_blank">Ray Boltz Blog</a>.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve heard it several times predicted, and Ray seems to agree, that this issue will be the next great civil rights struggle in America.</p>
<p><strong>*NOTE:  No bashing in the comments.</strong></p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/">February 5, 2009</a>, <a href='http://www.kevinbussey.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Kevin Bussey</a> writes: no bashing.  I just feel sorry for him.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/">February 6, 2009</a>, <a href='http://mightyfowl.blogspot.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Bob Cleveland</a> writes: If ".....fundamental to our very existence and survival” is the explanation offered for “Marriage is one of the basic civil rights of man...", I'd observe that's hardly the case with homosexual or lesbians unions.

<abbr><em>Bob Clevelands last blog post..<a href="http://mightyfowl.blogspot.com/2009/02/is-curtain-rising.html" rel="nofollow">Is The Curtain Rising?</a></abbr></em></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/">February 7, 2009</a>, <a href='http://sbcghostrecon.wordpress.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Quinn Hooks</a> writes: There will be no bashing from me. I just have a sincerely sadness for the direction he has taken.

<abbr><em>Quinn Hookss last blog post..<a href="http://sbcghostrecon.wordpress.com/2009/02/04/funny-animation/" rel="nofollow">Funny Animation</a></abbr></em></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/">June 16, 2009</a>, Bobby writes: No where in scripture does the Bible say that it is wrong for a black to marry a white (Check to see who Moses married).  However, scripture does say that relations between men and relations between women are wrong.  If Ray Boltz wants to live the lifestyle of a homosexual that is his business.  He should not, however, try to make it compatible with Christianity.  There is no way you can reconcile homosexuality and scripture.  To try to is theologically dishonest.  If Ray wants to be religious, he can be as religious as he wants but don't call that religion Chrisianity because it is not.</li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Ray Boltz confesses he is gay">Ray Boltz confesses he is gay</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/04/10/dont-waste-your-business-card/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Don&#8217;t waste your&#8230; Business Card">Don&#8217;t waste your&#8230; Business Card</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2010/09/20/leveraging-your-job-to-share-the-gospel/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Leveraging your job to share the Gospel">Leveraging your job to share the Gospel</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/04/06/mark-driscoll-on-evangelism-not-imposing-but-proposing/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Mark Driscoll on Evangelism: Not Imposing but Proposing">Mark Driscoll on Evangelism: Not Imposing but Proposing</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/03/01/dont-buy-durens-book-journeys/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Don&#8217;t buy Duren&#8217;s Book, Journeys">Don&#8217;t buy Duren&#8217;s Book, Journeys</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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</span><p>You may recall that Ray Boltz &#8220;came out of the closet&#8221; last year and openly confessed that he is living a homosexual lifestyle in Florida now.  You can read my article and the link to the Washington Blade magazine that carried the news in an interview with the singer:  <a title="12 Witnesses|Ray Boltz Confesses He Is Gay" href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/" target="_blank">Ray Boltz Confesses He Is Gay</a>.</p>
<p>He&#8217;s just released a new single paralleling the desire of homosexuals&#8217; to marry and the struggle to do so in America with the 1960&#8242;s era struggle of a white man&#8217;s struggle to marry a black woman detailed in the 1967 Supreme Court decision from the suit &#8220;Loving v. Virginia,&#8221; in which Chief Justice Warren wrote, &#8220;<span style="font-family: Arial;"><span style="font-size: small;">Marriage is one of the basic civil rights of man, fundamental to our very existence and survival.&#8221;</span></span></p>
<p>You can read the lyrics, hear the song and read what Boltz has to say about it on his blog:  <a title="Ray Boltz Blog|Don't Tell Me Who To Love" href="http://rayboltzblog.wordpress.com/2008/11/18/dont-tell-me-who-to-love-the-new-single/" target="_blank">Ray Boltz Blog</a>.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve heard it several times predicted, and Ray seems to agree, that this issue will be the next great civil rights struggle in America.</p>
<p><strong>*NOTE:  No bashing in the comments.</strong></p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/">February 5, 2009</a>, <a href='http://www.kevinbussey.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Kevin Bussey</a> writes: no bashing.  I just feel sorry for him.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/">February 6, 2009</a>, <a href='http://mightyfowl.blogspot.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Bob Cleveland</a> writes: If ".....fundamental to our very existence and survival” is the explanation offered for “Marriage is one of the basic civil rights of man...", I'd observe that's hardly the case with homosexual or lesbians unions.

<abbr><em>Bob Clevelands last blog post..<a href="http://mightyfowl.blogspot.com/2009/02/is-curtain-rising.html" rel="nofollow">Is The Curtain Rising?</a></abbr></em></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/">February 7, 2009</a>, <a href='http://sbcghostrecon.wordpress.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Quinn Hooks</a> writes: There will be no bashing from me. I just have a sincerely sadness for the direction he has taken.

<abbr><em>Quinn Hookss last blog post..<a href="http://sbcghostrecon.wordpress.com/2009/02/04/funny-animation/" rel="nofollow">Funny Animation</a></abbr></em></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/">June 16, 2009</a>, Bobby writes: No where in scripture does the Bible say that it is wrong for a black to marry a white (Check to see who Moses married).  However, scripture does say that relations between men and relations between women are wrong.  If Ray Boltz wants to live the lifestyle of a homosexual that is his business.  He should not, however, try to make it compatible with Christianity.  There is no way you can reconcile homosexuality and scripture.  To try to is theologically dishonest.  If Ray wants to be religious, he can be as religious as he wants but don't call that religion Chrisianity because it is not.</li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Ray Boltz confesses he is gay">Ray Boltz confesses he is gay</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/04/10/dont-waste-your-business-card/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Don&#8217;t waste your&#8230; Business Card">Don&#8217;t waste your&#8230; Business Card</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2010/09/20/leveraging-your-job-to-share-the-gospel/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Leveraging your job to share the Gospel">Leveraging your job to share the Gospel</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/04/06/mark-driscoll-on-evangelism-not-imposing-but-proposing/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Mark Driscoll on Evangelism: Not Imposing but Proposing">Mark Driscoll on Evangelism: Not Imposing but Proposing</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/03/01/dont-buy-durens-book-journeys/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Don&#8217;t buy Duren&#8217;s Book, Journeys">Don&#8217;t buy Duren&#8217;s Book, Journeys</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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		<title>Why are Christians always pictured in a moment of ecstatic worship?</title>
		<link>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/12/17/why-are-christians-always-pictured-in-a-moment-of-ecstatic-worship/</link>
		<comments>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/12/17/why-are-christians-always-pictured-in-a-moment-of-ecstatic-worship/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:01:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>art rogers</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Church]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/?p=1328</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[<p>Just curious, but why is it, especially among media writing negatively about Christians, but even among those writing more &#8220;neutral&#8221; stories, are pictures shown of a group at a point of ecstatic worship (speaking in tongues optional)?</p>
<p>For an example, check out this picture, entitled &#8220;evangelicals.jpg&#8221; used in an article slanted harshly against Christians in general and evangelicals in particular:</p>
<p><img class="size-full wp-image-1330 alignnone" title="evangelicals" src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/evangelicals.jpg" alt="evangelicals" width="250" height="166" /></p>
<p>You can find the article here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.beyondchron.org/articles/Evangelists_Cashing_in_on_Hard_Economic_Times_6385.html">Evangelists: Cashing in on Hard Economic Times</a></p>
<p>Most of the Evangelicals I know NEVER look like this, and those that do, only for a couple of moments per week.  Do people think we really walk around like this all day long?</p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/12/17/why-are-christians-always-pictured-in-a-moment-of-ecstatic-worship/">December 17, 2008</a>, <a href='http://www.rickboyne.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Rick Boyne</a> writes: If they were come and take a picture of my church during the most intense worship we've experienced since I've been here, you might accidentally catch a smile or two.  There is one lady that raises one hand almost as high as her shoulder.

<abbr><em>Rick Boynes last blog post..<a href="http://www.rickboyne.com/2008/12/gas-prices-going-up.html" rel="nofollow">Gas Prices Going UP?</a></abbr></em></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/12/17/why-are-christians-always-pictured-in-a-moment-of-ecstatic-worship/">December 17, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: I know!  We have a total of 3 hand raisers in our church, and we are fairly progressive in our worship.  High energy, happy to be here, focused on God kind of stuff.

It seems to me that the pictures are not intended to represent reality, but to present an ecstatic expression as the "norm" which makes us look cult-like, discrediting us.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/12/17/why-are-christians-always-pictured-in-a-moment-of-ecstatic-worship/">December 19, 2008</a>, <a href='http://www.BiggerRock.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Eric Vardeman</a> writes: we need more pictures of believers eating mexican food and cleaning the house and mowing the lawn and watching football games and sitting behind their desks at work. We live normal lives...we just live them in a manner worthy of the gospel of Christ. I think that's in the bible somewhere :-)</li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/07/16/until-i-die/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Until I Die&#8230;">Until I Die&#8230;</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/01/29/vietnam-microfinance/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Vietnam:  Microfinance">Vietnam:  Microfinance</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2005/10/13/idolatry/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Idolatry?">Idolatry?</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/05/08/10-things-we-don%e2%80%99t-mention/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: 10 things we don’t mention &#8230;">10 things we don’t mention &#8230;</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/05/20/spiritual-warfare/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Spiritual Warfare">Spiritual Warfare</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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</span><p>Just curious, but why is it, especially among media writing negatively about Christians, but even among those writing more &#8220;neutral&#8221; stories, are pictures shown of a group at a point of ecstatic worship (speaking in tongues optional)?</p>
<p>For an example, check out this picture, entitled &#8220;evangelicals.jpg&#8221; used in an article slanted harshly against Christians in general and evangelicals in particular:</p>
<p><img class="size-full wp-image-1330 alignnone" title="evangelicals" src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/evangelicals.jpg" alt="evangelicals" width="250" height="166" /></p>
<p>You can find the article here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.beyondchron.org/articles/Evangelists_Cashing_in_on_Hard_Economic_Times_6385.html">Evangelists: Cashing in on Hard Economic Times</a></p>
<p>Most of the Evangelicals I know NEVER look like this, and those that do, only for a couple of moments per week.  Do people think we really walk around like this all day long?</p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/12/17/why-are-christians-always-pictured-in-a-moment-of-ecstatic-worship/">December 17, 2008</a>, <a href='http://www.rickboyne.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Rick Boyne</a> writes: If they were come and take a picture of my church during the most intense worship we've experienced since I've been here, you might accidentally catch a smile or two.  There is one lady that raises one hand almost as high as her shoulder.

<abbr><em>Rick Boynes last blog post..<a href="http://www.rickboyne.com/2008/12/gas-prices-going-up.html" rel="nofollow">Gas Prices Going UP?</a></abbr></em></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/12/17/why-are-christians-always-pictured-in-a-moment-of-ecstatic-worship/">December 17, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: I know!  We have a total of 3 hand raisers in our church, and we are fairly progressive in our worship.  High energy, happy to be here, focused on God kind of stuff.

It seems to me that the pictures are not intended to represent reality, but to present an ecstatic expression as the "norm" which makes us look cult-like, discrediting us.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/12/17/why-are-christians-always-pictured-in-a-moment-of-ecstatic-worship/">December 19, 2008</a>, <a href='http://www.BiggerRock.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Eric Vardeman</a> writes: we need more pictures of believers eating mexican food and cleaning the house and mowing the lawn and watching football games and sitting behind their desks at work. We live normal lives...we just live them in a manner worthy of the gospel of Christ. I think that's in the bible somewhere :-)</li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/07/16/until-i-die/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Until I Die&#8230;">Until I Die&#8230;</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/01/29/vietnam-microfinance/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Vietnam:  Microfinance">Vietnam:  Microfinance</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2005/10/13/idolatry/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Idolatry?">Idolatry?</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/05/08/10-things-we-don%e2%80%99t-mention/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: 10 things we don’t mention &#8230;">10 things we don’t mention &#8230;</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/05/20/spiritual-warfare/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Spiritual Warfare">Spiritual Warfare</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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		<title>Wal-Mart Employee trampled to death on Black Friday</title>
		<link>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/11/28/wal-mart-employee-trampled-to-death-on-black-friday/</link>
		<comments>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/11/28/wal-mart-employee-trampled-to-death-on-black-friday/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Nov 2008 16:42:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>art rogers</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[News]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Weird]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[culture]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/?p=1274</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[<p>Several news agencies are reporting that a stock clerk in New Jersey lost his life as shoppers knocked him down and trampeled him to death today.  Apparently, few of the shoppers cared enough to even stop and observe the goings on.</p>
<p>It would appear that the only thing that got their attention was when store management shut the store down.</p>
<p>A pregnant lady was also knocked down and injured.  One source is reporting that the paramedics were overheard telling her that she lost the baby.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve often espoused the opinion that the hassle isn&#8217;t worth the deals.  I am quite confident that the deals aren&#8217;t worth being a part of a mob that values those deals over life.</p>
<p>You can read about it from these services:</p>
<p><a title="NY Daily News|Worker dies at Long Island Wal-Mart after being trampeled in Black Friday stampede" href="http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2008/11/28/2008-11-28_worker_dies_at_long_island_walmart_after.html" target="_blank">NY Daily News|Worker dies at Long Island Wal-Mart after being trampled in Black Friday stampede</a></p>
<p><a title="Chicago Tribune|Wal-Mart worker dies in Black Friday stampede" href="http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ny-lisale1128,0,7040884.story" target="_blank">Chicago Tribune|Wal-Mart worker dies in Black Friday stampede</a></p>
<p><a title="Balitmore Sun|Wal-Mart worker in N.Y. dies after being trampled during Black Friday event" href="http://www.baltimoresun.com/business/bal-blackfridaydeath1128,0,5016542.story" target="_blank">Balitmore Sun|Wal-Mart worker in N.Y. dies after being trampled during Black Friday event</a></p>
<p><a title="Fox 5 NY|Mall Worker Killed In Black Friday Trampling" href="http://www.myfoxny.com/myfox/pages/News/Detail?contentId=7963685&amp;version=3&amp;locale=EN-US&amp;layoutCode=TSTY&amp;pageId=3.2.1" target="_blank">Fox 5 NY|Mall Worker Killed In Black Friday Trampling</a></p>
<p><a title="KTAR.com|Wal-Mart worker dies after shoppers knock him down " href="http://ktar.com/?nid=45&amp;sid=999247&amp;r=1" target="_blank">KTAR.com|Wal-Mart worker dies after shoppers knock him down </a></p>
<p><!-- ===================[ STORY PAGES ]================= --> <!-- ===================[ STORY MEDIA ]================= --> <!-- ===================[ STORY RELATED ]================= --> <!-- ===================[ STORY HEAD : INTRO ]================= --> <!--this is the new 923 story body --></p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/11/28/wal-mart-employee-trampled-to-death-on-black-friday/">November 28, 2008</a>, <a href='http://cbscottreport.blogspot.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>cb scott</a> writes: I was born on a flat rock just outside the gates of hell.

I now believe the rock has grown and all of humanity lives on it.

May God have mercy on our wretched souls.

cb

<abbr><em>cb scotts last blog post..<a href="http://cbscottreport.blogspot.com/2008/11/based-upon-statements-made-and-actions.html" rel="nofollow">A CLEAR AND PRESENT DANGER</a></abbr></em></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/11/28/wal-mart-employee-trampled-to-death-on-black-friday/">November 28, 2008</a>, <a href='http://www.kevinbussey.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Kevin Bussey</a> writes: Sad and stupid!

<abbr><em>Kevin Busseys last blog post..<a href="http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/ConfessionsOfARecoveringPharisee/~3/463204289/" rel="nofollow">LIVE LONGER: START GOING TO CHURCH</a></abbr></em></li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/03/22/a-day-of-mourning/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: A Day of Mourning">A Day of Mourning</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2006/06/16/my-friday-photo/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: My Friday Photo">My Friday Photo</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/04/11/link-load-04-11-08/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Link Load 04-11-08">Link Load 04-11-08</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2006/06/13/executive-committee-and-by-law-15/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Executive Committee and By Law 15">Executive Committee and By Law 15</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/03/18/vietnam-2009-san-sa-ho/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Vietnam 2009: San Sa Ho">Vietnam 2009: San Sa Ho</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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</span><p>Several news agencies are reporting that a stock clerk in New Jersey lost his life as shoppers knocked him down and trampeled him to death today.  Apparently, few of the shoppers cared enough to even stop and observe the goings on.</p>
<p>It would appear that the only thing that got their attention was when store management shut the store down.</p>
<p>A pregnant lady was also knocked down and injured.  One source is reporting that the paramedics were overheard telling her that she lost the baby.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve often espoused the opinion that the hassle isn&#8217;t worth the deals.  I am quite confident that the deals aren&#8217;t worth being a part of a mob that values those deals over life.</p>
<p>You can read about it from these services:</p>
<p><a title="NY Daily News|Worker dies at Long Island Wal-Mart after being trampeled in Black Friday stampede" href="http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2008/11/28/2008-11-28_worker_dies_at_long_island_walmart_after.html" target="_blank">NY Daily News|Worker dies at Long Island Wal-Mart after being trampled in Black Friday stampede</a></p>
<p><a title="Chicago Tribune|Wal-Mart worker dies in Black Friday stampede" href="http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ny-lisale1128,0,7040884.story" target="_blank">Chicago Tribune|Wal-Mart worker dies in Black Friday stampede</a></p>
<p><a title="Balitmore Sun|Wal-Mart worker in N.Y. dies after being trampled during Black Friday event" href="http://www.baltimoresun.com/business/bal-blackfridaydeath1128,0,5016542.story" target="_blank">Balitmore Sun|Wal-Mart worker in N.Y. dies after being trampled during Black Friday event</a></p>
<p><a title="Fox 5 NY|Mall Worker Killed In Black Friday Trampling" href="http://www.myfoxny.com/myfox/pages/News/Detail?contentId=7963685&amp;version=3&amp;locale=EN-US&amp;layoutCode=TSTY&amp;pageId=3.2.1" target="_blank">Fox 5 NY|Mall Worker Killed In Black Friday Trampling</a></p>
<p><a title="KTAR.com|Wal-Mart worker dies after shoppers knock him down " href="http://ktar.com/?nid=45&amp;sid=999247&amp;r=1" target="_blank">KTAR.com|Wal-Mart worker dies after shoppers knock him down </a></p>
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<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/11/28/wal-mart-employee-trampled-to-death-on-black-friday/">November 28, 2008</a>, <a href='http://cbscottreport.blogspot.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>cb scott</a> writes: I was born on a flat rock just outside the gates of hell.

I now believe the rock has grown and all of humanity lives on it.

May God have mercy on our wretched souls.

cb

<abbr><em>cb scotts last blog post..<a href="http://cbscottreport.blogspot.com/2008/11/based-upon-statements-made-and-actions.html" rel="nofollow">A CLEAR AND PRESENT DANGER</a></abbr></em></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/11/28/wal-mart-employee-trampled-to-death-on-black-friday/">November 28, 2008</a>, <a href='http://www.kevinbussey.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Kevin Bussey</a> writes: Sad and stupid!

<abbr><em>Kevin Busseys last blog post..<a href="http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/ConfessionsOfARecoveringPharisee/~3/463204289/" rel="nofollow">LIVE LONGER: START GOING TO CHURCH</a></abbr></em></li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/03/22/a-day-of-mourning/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: A Day of Mourning">A Day of Mourning</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2006/06/16/my-friday-photo/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: My Friday Photo">My Friday Photo</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/04/11/link-load-04-11-08/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Link Load 04-11-08">Link Load 04-11-08</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2006/06/13/executive-committee-and-by-law-15/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Executive Committee and By Law 15">Executive Committee and By Law 15</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/03/18/vietnam-2009-san-sa-ho/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Vietnam 2009: San Sa Ho">Vietnam 2009: San Sa Ho</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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		<title>Ray Boltz confesses he is gay</title>
		<link>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/</link>
		<comments>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Sep 2008 21:59:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>art rogers</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Church]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[General Christian]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[News]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[culture]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/?p=1122</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[<p>This one may shock a few people.  Former Contemporary Christian Music vocalist Ray Boltz has been interviewed by the Washington Blade, a periodical focusing on homosexual issues.  In that interview, Boltz tells of his journey through life, CCM and the revelation of his internal struggle to his family on the day after Christmas in 2006.</p>
<p>Boltz is now divorced amicably and living an openly gay lifestyle in Florida.</p>
<p>Also in the article is the story of Christians who are reaching out to him AFTER his revelation.  It is interesting to note that one church even had him sing in their services.</p>
<p>Boltz has had some of his songs become somewhat iconic among church culture in America with songs like, &#8220;I Pledge Allegiance to the Lamb,&#8221; that mixes patriotic symbolism in with devotion to Christ.  No song has been more touching, used and possibly over used, than the song, &#8220;Thank You,&#8221; where the singer tells of going to Heaven to find all the people who have been touched by his life lining up to thank him for serving the Lord.</p>
<p>You can read the full article here:</p>
<p><a title="Ray Bolz confesses he is gay|Key Changes|Washington Blade" href="http://www.washingtonblade.com/2008/9-12/arts/feature/13258.cfm" target="_blank">Key Changes &#8211; Washington Blade</a></p>
<p>[Comments are now closed]</p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 13, 2008</a>, <a href='http://debbiekaufman.wordpress.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Debbie Kaufman</a> writes: After over thirty years of being a Christian, surely he has to know this is a sin. He is openly living in sin. There are so many in the Christian community deep in sin, it makes me wonder why?

Debbie Kaufmans last blog post..<a href="http://debbiekaufman.wordpress.com/2008/09/13/jesus-is-my-friend/" rel="nofollow">Jesus Is My Friend</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 13, 2008</a>, <a href='http://lesliepuryear.blogspot.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Les Puryear</a> writes: I am praying for Ray. This is so sad.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 13, 2008</a>, <a href='http://www.kevinbussey.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Kevin Bussey</a> writes: I'm with Les, I will pray for Ray.  Sins have powerful holds on all of us.

Kevin Busseys last blog post..<a href="http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/ConfessionsOfARecoveringPharisee/~3/391702402/" rel="nofollow">Pope urges crackdown on reported visions of Mary</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 15, 2008</a>, Krispykr33m writes: Ray says in the interview: "That he was living a lie" well that's more than likely true because since I found out what the meaning of "Born Again" means! I thought I knew what it meant to be saved but for 15 years I was a Christian in name only!
Gods Grace saved me even before I was born.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 15, 2008</a>, Ricky Szewczyk writes: I've met Ray several times in the past &amp; have talked to him briefly.  The last time was at the 2003 Cornerstone Festival where Ray was promoting his independent record company.  The problem here is much more than just "a Christian sinning".  Paul called himself the "chief of sinners" &amp; claimed that he "sinned daily".  However Paul was repentant of those sins.  Ray has decided to end his Godly "hetro-sexual" marriage &amp; knowingly enter into a very wrong alternate lifestyle.  Add to that the fact that he is a MINISTER who's music has touched lives all over the world &amp; now his accountability level is even higher.  Love him?  yes!  Forgive him?  Of course?  Treat him as a minister of the gospel &amp; enable his sinful lifestyle that has to have had very severe reprecussions on his family as well as the Christian Community?  NO!  I, too, am sad &amp; will keep Ray in prayer; but we have to realize that those in ministry are held to a higher level of accountability than the average Christian.  (James 3: 1.)</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 15, 2008</a>, Greg Davis writes: Ray probably loved the truth more than he feared damnation from God. When I lived in Nashville I was surrounded by artists and musicians and Christians with same sex attraction who lived painful lives "dying to self" yet unable to "transform" into the butterfly as the Word promised. There comes a place where a person has face the big 'ol Wall of Truth despite everything you've ever believed to be true. The disgrace is that people who have never experienced the twistedness of living what your soul knows is a lie with themselves catapult the Word of God from a safe distance. Above all, if God is God, there should never be a life lived in opposition to the truth. Ray did that for years with his wife and family and, contrary to what even HE believed, truth prevailed. You can narrowly quote scripture left and right and claim its authenticity, but truth resonates in the heart like the ring of pure crystal and Ray finally came to a place where he couldn't deny the truth. He abandoned his untruthful "lifestyle" of Christian denial and opened himself to be the man he believes he was created to be. God is not mocked: a lie is a lie no matter how much scripture we think we understand.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 15, 2008</a>, Matt Knight writes: I am really surprised by this.  I haven't followed Ray's life or career for quite some time, but I would not have expected this.  I will be praying for him and for his family.  It's hurtful to know that Ray, like so many other Christian leaders before him, is giving up his ministry for his sinful lifestyle.  I pray that I will hold more closely to my relationship with Christ and never fall into some sinful lifestyle of my own.  

We must all take heed, that we do not fall (1 Cor 10:12-13).  God's word is truth.  We must remember that His word judges us, we do not judge it.  Our feelings are tricky because we are sinful, and still unperfected here on earth.  I don't believe that Ray found some new revelation from God or that God is pleased with how he is living now.  But I do pray that God will use this time and those around Ray to love him and bring him back into a fruitful relationship with God and that He will be able to finish the race well, despite these missteps.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 16, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: Greg Davis,

I would agree with you that there is some "truth" to the fact that Ray has struggled with this for his entire life and there was some elements of a "lie" in his life.

Beyond that, I disagree with just about everything you say.  You clearly claim that the standard of ultimate truth is the heart of the person while denying that Scripture has anything to do with it.

I understand that belief in Scripture is a faith presupposition.  Nothing I can ever say or do can convince you of its truth.

Nevertheless, I can clearly state to you that I do believe that God is fully capable of delivering to us His revelation of Himself and that He has done that in His Word.

Again, you don't buy my perspective.  I get that.

What I can point out to you is that the perspective you espouse leads to some endorsements that you may not be comfortable endorsing.

I the heart is the guide then truly following their heart is being faithful to God, if I understand you.  That would mean that racist members of the KKK, who truly believe, are exactly what is right and God endorses their behavior.  Just as an example.

Jeremiah 17:9-10 says:

<blockquote><b>9 The heart is more deceitful than anything else    and desperately sick—who can understand it?

10 I, the LORD, examine the mind, I test the heart to give to each according to his way, according to what his actions deserve. </b></blockquote></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 16, 2008</a>, <a href='http://iemissional.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Marty Duren</a> writes: Art-
A friend and I were having a similar conversation on Sunday morning when I was reminded of a famed Christian writer, Henri Nouwen, who lived his entire adult life as a celibate homosexual.  To state it another way, he struggled with homosexual temptations through adulthood but chose to stay celibate.  He never revealed this while he was alive and it was only after his private notebooks and papers were released after his death that the world know of his intense struggle.

I believe that this issue is only going to intensify in the west since it is going to become the "new civil rights" struggle for many. If churches do their normally incoherent job of formulating a way to understand and minister to those caught in this sin or overwhelmed by this temptation even if they choose not to sin, then we will wind up losing even more credibility than we already have.

The reality is that virtually everyone struggles with some form of sexual temptation.  It's just that our tendency is condemn the one that isn't our particular struggle.

Regarding Ray Boltz: I have great pity for him and great sympathy for his wife.  The simple fact is that he promised to remain faithful to her, forsaking all others until God parted them by death.  I don't think that "death of affections" were what God was referencing.  There is a difference, I feel, between Nouwen's struggle against that sin and Boltz' proclamation of being gay.  Our current cultural climate makes the second easier than the first and our Christian sub-culture makes the first difficult enough.

Marty Durens last blog post..<a href="http://iemissional.com/2008/09/02/a-missional-must-read/" rel="nofollow">A Missional Must Read</a></li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Ray Boltz new single:  Don&#8217;t Tell Me Who To Love">Ray Boltz new single:  Don&#8217;t Tell Me Who To Love</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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</span><p>This one may shock a few people.  Former Contemporary Christian Music vocalist Ray Boltz has been interviewed by the Washington Blade, a periodical focusing on homosexual issues.  In that interview, Boltz tells of his journey through life, CCM and the revelation of his internal struggle to his family on the day after Christmas in 2006.</p>
<p>Boltz is now divorced amicably and living an openly gay lifestyle in Florida.</p>
<p>Also in the article is the story of Christians who are reaching out to him AFTER his revelation.  It is interesting to note that one church even had him sing in their services.</p>
<p>Boltz has had some of his songs become somewhat iconic among church culture in America with songs like, &#8220;I Pledge Allegiance to the Lamb,&#8221; that mixes patriotic symbolism in with devotion to Christ.  No song has been more touching, used and possibly over used, than the song, &#8220;Thank You,&#8221; where the singer tells of going to Heaven to find all the people who have been touched by his life lining up to thank him for serving the Lord.</p>
<p>You can read the full article here:</p>
<p><a title="Ray Bolz confesses he is gay|Key Changes|Washington Blade" href="http://www.washingtonblade.com/2008/9-12/arts/feature/13258.cfm" target="_blank">Key Changes &#8211; Washington Blade</a></p>
<p>[Comments are now closed]</p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 13, 2008</a>, <a href='http://debbiekaufman.wordpress.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Debbie Kaufman</a> writes: After over thirty years of being a Christian, surely he has to know this is a sin. He is openly living in sin. There are so many in the Christian community deep in sin, it makes me wonder why?

Debbie Kaufmans last blog post..<a href="http://debbiekaufman.wordpress.com/2008/09/13/jesus-is-my-friend/" rel="nofollow">Jesus Is My Friend</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 13, 2008</a>, <a href='http://lesliepuryear.blogspot.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Les Puryear</a> writes: I am praying for Ray. This is so sad.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 13, 2008</a>, <a href='http://www.kevinbussey.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Kevin Bussey</a> writes: I'm with Les, I will pray for Ray.  Sins have powerful holds on all of us.

Kevin Busseys last blog post..<a href="http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/ConfessionsOfARecoveringPharisee/~3/391702402/" rel="nofollow">Pope urges crackdown on reported visions of Mary</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 15, 2008</a>, Krispykr33m writes: Ray says in the interview: "That he was living a lie" well that's more than likely true because since I found out what the meaning of "Born Again" means! I thought I knew what it meant to be saved but for 15 years I was a Christian in name only!
Gods Grace saved me even before I was born.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 15, 2008</a>, Ricky Szewczyk writes: I've met Ray several times in the past &amp; have talked to him briefly.  The last time was at the 2003 Cornerstone Festival where Ray was promoting his independent record company.  The problem here is much more than just "a Christian sinning".  Paul called himself the "chief of sinners" &amp; claimed that he "sinned daily".  However Paul was repentant of those sins.  Ray has decided to end his Godly "hetro-sexual" marriage &amp; knowingly enter into a very wrong alternate lifestyle.  Add to that the fact that he is a MINISTER who's music has touched lives all over the world &amp; now his accountability level is even higher.  Love him?  yes!  Forgive him?  Of course?  Treat him as a minister of the gospel &amp; enable his sinful lifestyle that has to have had very severe reprecussions on his family as well as the Christian Community?  NO!  I, too, am sad &amp; will keep Ray in prayer; but we have to realize that those in ministry are held to a higher level of accountability than the average Christian.  (James 3: 1.)</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 15, 2008</a>, Greg Davis writes: Ray probably loved the truth more than he feared damnation from God. When I lived in Nashville I was surrounded by artists and musicians and Christians with same sex attraction who lived painful lives "dying to self" yet unable to "transform" into the butterfly as the Word promised. There comes a place where a person has face the big 'ol Wall of Truth despite everything you've ever believed to be true. The disgrace is that people who have never experienced the twistedness of living what your soul knows is a lie with themselves catapult the Word of God from a safe distance. Above all, if God is God, there should never be a life lived in opposition to the truth. Ray did that for years with his wife and family and, contrary to what even HE believed, truth prevailed. You can narrowly quote scripture left and right and claim its authenticity, but truth resonates in the heart like the ring of pure crystal and Ray finally came to a place where he couldn't deny the truth. He abandoned his untruthful "lifestyle" of Christian denial and opened himself to be the man he believes he was created to be. God is not mocked: a lie is a lie no matter how much scripture we think we understand.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 15, 2008</a>, Matt Knight writes: I am really surprised by this.  I haven't followed Ray's life or career for quite some time, but I would not have expected this.  I will be praying for him and for his family.  It's hurtful to know that Ray, like so many other Christian leaders before him, is giving up his ministry for his sinful lifestyle.  I pray that I will hold more closely to my relationship with Christ and never fall into some sinful lifestyle of my own.  

We must all take heed, that we do not fall (1 Cor 10:12-13).  God's word is truth.  We must remember that His word judges us, we do not judge it.  Our feelings are tricky because we are sinful, and still unperfected here on earth.  I don't believe that Ray found some new revelation from God or that God is pleased with how he is living now.  But I do pray that God will use this time and those around Ray to love him and bring him back into a fruitful relationship with God and that He will be able to finish the race well, despite these missteps.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 16, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: Greg Davis,

I would agree with you that there is some "truth" to the fact that Ray has struggled with this for his entire life and there was some elements of a "lie" in his life.

Beyond that, I disagree with just about everything you say.  You clearly claim that the standard of ultimate truth is the heart of the person while denying that Scripture has anything to do with it.

I understand that belief in Scripture is a faith presupposition.  Nothing I can ever say or do can convince you of its truth.

Nevertheless, I can clearly state to you that I do believe that God is fully capable of delivering to us His revelation of Himself and that He has done that in His Word.

Again, you don't buy my perspective.  I get that.

What I can point out to you is that the perspective you espouse leads to some endorsements that you may not be comfortable endorsing.

I the heart is the guide then truly following their heart is being faithful to God, if I understand you.  That would mean that racist members of the KKK, who truly believe, are exactly what is right and God endorses their behavior.  Just as an example.

Jeremiah 17:9-10 says:

<blockquote><b>9 The heart is more deceitful than anything else    and desperately sick—who can understand it?

10 I, the LORD, examine the mind, I test the heart to give to each according to his way, according to what his actions deserve. </b></blockquote></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/09/13/ray-boltz-confesses-he-is-gay/">September 16, 2008</a>, <a href='http://iemissional.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Marty Duren</a> writes: Art-
A friend and I were having a similar conversation on Sunday morning when I was reminded of a famed Christian writer, Henri Nouwen, who lived his entire adult life as a celibate homosexual.  To state it another way, he struggled with homosexual temptations through adulthood but chose to stay celibate.  He never revealed this while he was alive and it was only after his private notebooks and papers were released after his death that the world know of his intense struggle.

I believe that this issue is only going to intensify in the west since it is going to become the "new civil rights" struggle for many. If churches do their normally incoherent job of formulating a way to understand and minister to those caught in this sin or overwhelmed by this temptation even if they choose not to sin, then we will wind up losing even more credibility than we already have.

The reality is that virtually everyone struggles with some form of sexual temptation.  It's just that our tendency is condemn the one that isn't our particular struggle.

Regarding Ray Boltz: I have great pity for him and great sympathy for his wife.  The simple fact is that he promised to remain faithful to her, forsaking all others until God parted them by death.  I don't think that "death of affections" were what God was referencing.  There is a difference, I feel, between Nouwen's struggle against that sin and Boltz' proclamation of being gay.  Our current cultural climate makes the second easier than the first and our Christian sub-culture makes the first difficult enough.

Marty Durens last blog post..<a href="http://iemissional.com/2008/09/02/a-missional-must-read/" rel="nofollow">A Missional Must Read</a></li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/02/05/ray-boltz-new-single-dont-tell-me-who-to-love/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Ray Boltz new single:  Don&#8217;t Tell Me Who To Love">Ray Boltz new single:  Don&#8217;t Tell Me Who To Love</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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		<title>Pew Research Shows Americans&#8217; Spirituality Schizophrenic</title>
		<link>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/26/pew-research-shows-americans-spirituality-schizophreni/</link>
		<comments>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/26/pew-research-shows-americans-spirituality-schizophreni/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jun 2008 05:01:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>art rogers</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Church]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[General Christian]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Missional]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[News]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[culture]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/?p=797</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s a quote from the Washington Post Article:</p>
<blockquote><p><strong>The study detailed Americans&#8217; deep and broad religiosity, finding that 92 percent believe in God or a universal spirit &#8212; including one in five of those who call themselves atheists. More than half of Americans polled pray at least once a day.</strong></p></blockquote>
<p>This is what comes when attending church becomes the culture instead of the Church shaping the culture via the proclamation of the Gospel which results in the salvation and then sanctification of the lost.</p>
<p>Read the whole thing here: <a title="The Washington Post|Most Americans Believe in Higher Power, Poll Finds" href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/23/AR2008062300813.html" target="_blank">Most Americans Believe in Higher Power, Poll Finds</a></p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/06/28/losing-trust-in-the-church/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Losing Trust in the Church">Losing Trust in the Church</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/03/26/simple-things-learned/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Simple Things Learned">Simple Things Learned</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/10/18/missional-minatrea-continuum-of-perspective/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Missional Minatrea:  Continuum of Perspective">Missional Minatrea:  Continuum of Perspective</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/09/08/partnering-with-the-unholy/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Partnering with the Unholy">Partnering with the Unholy</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/08/08/leaving-church-remix/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Leaving Church, Remix">Leaving Church, Remix</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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</span><p>Here&#8217;s a quote from the Washington Post Article:</p>
<blockquote><p><strong>The study detailed Americans&#8217; deep and broad religiosity, finding that 92 percent believe in God or a universal spirit &#8212; including one in five of those who call themselves atheists. More than half of Americans polled pray at least once a day.</strong></p></blockquote>
<p>This is what comes when attending church becomes the culture instead of the Church shaping the culture via the proclamation of the Gospel which results in the salvation and then sanctification of the lost.</p>
<p>Read the whole thing here: <a title="The Washington Post|Most Americans Believe in Higher Power, Poll Finds" href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/23/AR2008062300813.html" target="_blank">Most Americans Believe in Higher Power, Poll Finds</a></p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/06/28/losing-trust-in-the-church/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Losing Trust in the Church">Losing Trust in the Church</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/03/26/simple-things-learned/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Simple Things Learned">Simple Things Learned</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/10/18/missional-minatrea-continuum-of-perspective/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Missional Minatrea:  Continuum of Perspective">Missional Minatrea:  Continuum of Perspective</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2009/09/08/partnering-with-the-unholy/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Partnering with the Unholy">Partnering with the Unholy</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/08/08/leaving-church-remix/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Leaving Church, Remix">Leaving Church, Remix</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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		<title>Stimulus Checks?</title>
		<link>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/</link>
		<comments>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jun 2008 14:40:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>art rogers</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[News]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[life]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/?p=793</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[<p>Have you gotten your &#8220;Economic Stimulus Check&#8221; from the government yet?  If not, like me, there is a pretty easy solution for finding out your check&#8217;s status.  The <a title="IRS Stimulus Check Website" href="http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=177937,00.html" target="_blank">website</a> has a printed schedule, but the IRS seems to be behind in sending out the money.  Hmmm.  Surprised?</p>
<p>Anyway, if you call the IRS&#8217; automated hotline, with a few easy questions, you can find out when your check is due to be mailed.  The number is:  1-866-234-2942.  You should know where you stand in a few minutes.</p>
<p>Now, what will you do with yours?</p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://mightyfowl.blogspot.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Bob Cleveland</a> writes: I'm going to do just what I'm supposed to do with it, and spend it (on attending the SBC convention in Indianapolis).

See? I was planning ahead, that's all.

Bob Clevelands last blog post..<a href="http://mightyfowl.blogspot.com/2008/06/its-hard-to-call-this-changing-paradigm.html" rel="nofollow">It's Hard To Call This A &quot;Changing Paradigm&quot;....&quot;</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://relevintage.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>brad andrews</a> writes: art-

so looking forward to speaking with you soon...

on a completely different side note, i noticed something in my feed of your blog that i absolutely love.  within the feed were the comments.  i've never seen that before.  i've always thought that would be a great feature...

is that something you can only set up with your own feed to do?

brad andrewss last blog post..<a href="http://relevintage.com/todays-tweets-34/" rel="nofollow">today’s tweets</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: <p>brad,</p>

It's because I got mad skilz.

And a cool plugin called copyfeed, which allows for that, the copyright paragraph at the end, the related posts and the comments.

And mad skilz.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://micahfries.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Micah Fries</a> writes: Art-

Not only do we have ours, but we got it a month ago. Ours was used to help pay for our recent 3,000 mile jaunt across the Eastern US. 

As an aside, mad skilz? Really? That's interesting..... :-)

Micah Friess last blog post..<a href="http://micahfries.com/2008/06/24/church-technology-just-keeps-coming/" rel="nofollow">Church technology just keeps coming</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: <p>Micah,</p>

You can't deny.  Don't hate.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://micahfries.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Micah Fries</a> writes: What was that sbclover?

Micah Friess last blog post..<a href="http://micahfries.com/2008/06/24/church-technology-just-keeps-coming/" rel="nofollow">Church technology just keeps coming</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: <p>Micah:</p>

Hater.</li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/10/16/small-hidden-economic-stimulus/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Small, Hidden Economic Stimulus">Small, Hidden Economic Stimulus</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/04/18/art-rogers-snap-2020-sbc-executive-committee-child-sexual-abuse-preacher-predators/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Page says &#8217;20/20&#8242; segment one-sided">Page says &#8217;20/20&#8242; segment one-sided</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/02/12/pastor-blogging-blog-time-management-firefox-wordpress/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Pastoral Blogging pt. 4">Pastoral Blogging pt. 4</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/05/29/church-staffing-the-search/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Church Staffing:  The Search">Church Staffing:  The Search</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/05/29/youth-ministry-is-sometimes-inverse-missionality/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Youth Ministry is (sometimes) Inverse Missionality">Youth Ministry is (sometimes) Inverse Missionality</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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</span><p>Have you gotten your &#8220;Economic Stimulus Check&#8221; from the government yet?  If not, like me, there is a pretty easy solution for finding out your check&#8217;s status.  The <a title="IRS Stimulus Check Website" href="http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=177937,00.html" target="_blank">website</a> has a printed schedule, but the IRS seems to be behind in sending out the money.  Hmmm.  Surprised?</p>
<p>Anyway, if you call the IRS&#8217; automated hotline, with a few easy questions, you can find out when your check is due to be mailed.  The number is:  1-866-234-2942.  You should know where you stand in a few minutes.</p>
<p>Now, what will you do with yours?</p>
<img src="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/eadd809f/266bb3ef/CCBot/1.0 (+http://www.commoncrawl.org/bot.html).gif" /><hr /><h2>Comments</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://mightyfowl.blogspot.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Bob Cleveland</a> writes: I'm going to do just what I'm supposed to do with it, and spend it (on attending the SBC convention in Indianapolis).

See? I was planning ahead, that's all.

Bob Clevelands last blog post..<a href="http://mightyfowl.blogspot.com/2008/06/its-hard-to-call-this-changing-paradigm.html" rel="nofollow">It's Hard To Call This A &quot;Changing Paradigm&quot;....&quot;</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://relevintage.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>brad andrews</a> writes: art-

so looking forward to speaking with you soon...

on a completely different side note, i noticed something in my feed of your blog that i absolutely love.  within the feed were the comments.  i've never seen that before.  i've always thought that would be a great feature...

is that something you can only set up with your own feed to do?

brad andrewss last blog post..<a href="http://relevintage.com/todays-tweets-34/" rel="nofollow">today’s tweets</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: <p>brad,</p>

It's because I got mad skilz.

And a cool plugin called copyfeed, which allows for that, the copyright paragraph at the end, the related posts and the comments.

And mad skilz.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://micahfries.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Micah Fries</a> writes: Art-

Not only do we have ours, but we got it a month ago. Ours was used to help pay for our recent 3,000 mile jaunt across the Eastern US. 

As an aside, mad skilz? Really? That's interesting..... :-)

Micah Friess last blog post..<a href="http://micahfries.com/2008/06/24/church-technology-just-keeps-coming/" rel="nofollow">Church technology just keeps coming</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: <p>Micah,</p>

You can't deny.  Don't hate.</li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://micahfries.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>Micah Fries</a> writes: What was that sbclover?

Micah Friess last blog post..<a href="http://micahfries.com/2008/06/24/church-technology-just-keeps-coming/" rel="nofollow">Church technology just keeps coming</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/06/24/stimulus-checks/">June 24, 2008</a>, <a href='http://twelvewitnesses.com' rel='external nofollow' class='url'>art rogers</a> writes: <p>Micah:</p>

Hater.</li></ul><hr /><h2>Related posts:</h2><ul><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/10/16/small-hidden-economic-stimulus/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Small, Hidden Economic Stimulus">Small, Hidden Economic Stimulus</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/04/18/art-rogers-snap-2020-sbc-executive-committee-child-sexual-abuse-preacher-predators/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Page says &#8217;20/20&#8242; segment one-sided">Page says &#8217;20/20&#8242; segment one-sided</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/02/12/pastor-blogging-blog-time-management-firefox-wordpress/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Pastoral Blogging pt. 4">Pastoral Blogging pt. 4</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/05/29/church-staffing-the-search/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Church Staffing:  The Search">Church Staffing:  The Search</a></li><li><a href="http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2007/05/29/youth-ministry-is-sometimes-inverse-missionality/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: Youth Ministry is (sometimes) Inverse Missionality">Youth Ministry is (sometimes) Inverse Missionality</a></li></ul><hr /><small>Copyright &copy; Art Rogers|12 Witnesses 2008<br /> This feed is for personal, non-commercial use only. <br /> The use of this feed on other websites breaches copyright. If this content is not in your news reader, it makes the page you are viewing an infringement of the copyright. If you suspect copyright infringement, please contact legal@twelvewitnesses.com.  Thanks.  (Digital Fingerprint:<br /> 4fb9806df94a8f093ce1b84a21d62535 (38.107.179.239) )</small>
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		<item>
		<title>Oklahoma City Bombing Anniversary 13 Years</title>
		<link>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/04/19/oklahoma-city-bombing-anniversary-13-years/</link>
		<comments>http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/2008/04/19/oklahoma-city-bombing-anniversary-13-years/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Apr 2008 05:01:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>art rogers</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[News]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.twelvewitnesses.com/?p=708</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Remembering the OKC Bombing.]]></description>
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